CNN Anchor, Fareed Zakaria’s Conversation With President Mohammad Ashraf Ghani During World Economic Forum’s Annual Meeting (2019) In Davos, Switzerland. - Office of the President

Fareed Zakaria: Ladies and gentlemen, thank you so much for coming to this. If I may start before welcoming our honored guest with a few ground rules, we are very appreciative with our audience here at with. This show is also being taped for my CNN program and will be watched by many millions more, so as a courtesy, I would ask that you genuinely turn off your phones so that they do not interrupt the recording. And also if you could just hold off any applause, comments, we’d like to be able to broadcast this in a way that many people can take advantage of the wisdom of our special guest.

So, Henry Kissinger once said, “Those who don’t need introductions crave them the most”. I think this is not true of the President of Afghanistan Ashraf Ghani, entirely rare figure in the modern world and being a genuinely world-class academic, genuine thought leader, a person who had worked at the highest levels of the international system, who then went on to lead a country and has been very successful. So with that, Ashraf Ghani, pleasure to have you.

President Ghani: well, thank you for that marvelous introduction. It is great pleasure to see you and to have opportunity to exchange views with you.

Fareed Zakaria:  So the first thing I am going to ask you is what appears to be some breaking news. It is not confirmed. There are reports that, in Doha, there has been some kind of a deal made with the Taliban involving with withdrawal of the American troops and presumably some kind of deal that the Taliban accepts. Is there any truth to these reports? What can you tell us about these negotiations?

President Ghani: Well. Thank you. Peace is an imperative. A war that has gone on for 17 years must come to an end. This war is multidimensional, it is very strong levels of interrelationships and it is not as simple to arrive at a date and think that the war as simply ends because of that—because the side of the government of Afghanistan—we have binding legal agreements with the United States and NATO, bilateral agreements and of course, multinational agreements internationally regarding assistance, trade and others.

The Taliban have a series of interrelationships that are below the surface. They have relationships with all known terrorist groups; they have relationships with the largest criminal mafia on earth, which after cocaine is the heroine mafia. They have an organic relationship with the state of Pakistan that has provided them sanctuary, resources, support and others, and they have patron client relationships with the others. This is a cluster of relationships.

US is committed to see a timeline to the engagements, but to just think that a relationship has arrived, I think, is exaggerated. We need to be able to get the relationship because the dimension that is national namely the Taliban and the Afghan people and the Afghan government, must be resolved politically, but the dimensions that continue the violence and the reason that the international forces are present in Afghanistan is not because of Afghanistan, but because 9/11 on one estimate cost the United States government and society $500 billion.

How do we deal with all these sets of relationship? We have a roadmap, we have detailed discussions. Let us not also forget that Ambassador Khalilzad, my old friend, and especial envoy, was not able to meet with Taliban representatives in Pakistan. Does Doha have that authority and the function of Ambassador Khalilzad’s office is that the Afghan government and the Taliban into face-to-face discussions and negotiations. Within that, then the larger issues of US presence and other international issues will be addressed.

Fareed Zakaria: But there is no breakthrough, you are saying, in recent days.

President Ghani: Not in that sense. There is discussion but the discussion needs to be shared back. A discussion that does not involve the region will not last. Afghanistan has national dimensions, neighborhood dimensions, the regional dimension, from India to Russia, the Gulf, Islamic and international. If we don’t get all the pieces right, one piece alone doesn’t suffice.

Fareed Zakaria:  How would you respond the people in America, maybe another western countries that have sent troops for seventeen years; this has gone on for 17 years. What have we got now different? We have failed in some sense, they would argue.

President Ghani: No, absolutely, but the first thing is, the United States is not there because it is fighting in Afghanistan. It is fighting for its security. Second, we have engaged in a very open dialogue. The United States as a sovereign power, as a global power, is entitled to leave. But we need to get the departure right. Are the fundamental reasons that brought the United States to Afghanistan—are those objectives accomplished? The first issue is cost. We completely agree that the cost must come down, must become more efficient. So the first thing I request is that everything under the sun should not be built under the war in Afghanistan. When the US navy needs money, when the US army needs money, the US air force, it bills it under Afghanistan. What is the cost of the war in Afghanistan?

Second, the number of troops. We are engaged in a discussion, we had initiated this to see that the number corresponds the essential needs, because every US soldier essential at least cost a million dollars a year. On making it more efficient—this is crucial. And we understand that our relationship is based on mutual interest which flows from mutual threats on the one hand, and mutual goals on the other.

So my answer first, I pay tribute to every mother and father who have lost their children in Afghanistan. This has included the highest levels of government, like Secretary Kelly, chief of staff, who lost his son in Helmand.

Second, over a million American soldiers, men and women in uniform, have seen action in Afghanistan; we pay tribute. But the job that we started together needs to move.

Thirdly, since I have become president, a hundred thousand troops left. Over 45,000 Afghan security personnel have paid the ultimate sacrifice. The number of international casualties is less than 72. So it shows you who is doing the fighting and the support is mutual. We need to get a stable Afghanistan as an entity that can ensure security of America and Europe and others on the one hand, but more fundamentally our own democratic rights and institutions and our right to live in peace and harmony.

Fareed Zakaria:  And if I look at Afghanistan today, what I am struck by is, you have a functioning democracy; you are up for elections, your elections again in July. There have not been major terrorist attacks in recent months. The economy seems to be moving forward. Is it fair to say that Afghanistan has turned the corner?

President Ghani: Afghanistan is turning the corner. My first tribute is to the Afghan women. Afghan women have come to voice their own. In 33 provinces of Afghanistan there have been discussions, and the last one is taking place now. We are going to have the first Jirga – the gathering – of all Afghan women in the coming month. These are people who grow, come from the grass roots. What do they want? A democratic, orderly system. Second is the youth, the youth of Afghanistan has really come to its own. Please understand that Afghanistan of today is a very different Afghanistan in terms of demographic composition. And three are the poor.

Fareed Zakaria:  Different even from Afghanistan of 9/11 in 2001.

President Ghani: Absolutely. Because this generation—we lost three generations to war. This is the first generation that has gone directly from refugee camps and internally displaced people to the best universities on earth, educational capability. We are now able to staff a modern administration and run it, so the ownership and leadership that has come. It is also networked generation. They talk. They are rooted on the ground, but they are able to talk to all our neighbors and to that the global community in a language.

And the economy is beginning to move fundamentally, but the most important thing is our constitution. As you mentioned presidential elections will take place in July. The people of Afghanistan will select their leaders. From 1747, when the last incarnation of continuous Afghan State has taken place until I succeeded president Karzai, with couple of exceptions, every succession involved a conflict. And in 1992 after the collapse of the Soviet-backed regime, there was no agreement on rules of the game; Kabul was destroyed. The country went to a level of deprivation and destitution that didn’t know. Why? Because a number of people who had all been friends could not agree on rules of the game. The rules of the game are now placed in the constitution. - Read More

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